Would You Buy It Again?

[Diesel chaser]

NO we would not buy another RW, that is why our 2015 Excel is on order. RW wants to be an upper end rig but they have alot of issues to over come before they will ever get there. Is there a perfect unit out there NO, as Dave said these are rolling earthquakes. We did not buy our RW with out giving it a lot of research, unfortunitly most of the issues that have affected people didn't show up until after we had purchased ours. As others have said no matter what brand you buy the dealer can make abig difference in your love/hate relationship with your rig too.

[tampabikeracer]

Originally Posted by Diesel chaser

NO we would not buy another RW, that is why our 2015 Excel is on order. RW wants to be an upper end rig but they have alot of issues to over come before they will ever get there. Is there a perfect unit out there NO, as Dave said these are rolling earthquakes. We did not buy our RW with out giving it a lot of research, unfortunitly most of the issues that have affected people didn't show up until after we had purchased ours. As others have said no matter what brand you buy the dealer can make abig difference in your love/hate relationship with your rig too.

Thanks, Tom. I appreciate your post. Were your issues related to the frame or suspension? I realize how complicated all of the components of an RV can be, but I am a mechanic by trade, and most issues I could fix myself. my main concerns about any unit I might purchase are from the frame on down.

[GloRVing]

Yes. I am also curious what your reasons are for not being happy with your purchase. We have only had our 38RL since the end of May so we don't have too much experience with it yet. We have had some early problems but are still, overall, pretty happy with our coach.

[GeorgiaRv]

At first glance the Redwood Brand is very appealing, we have a 2012 36RL and putting aside the normal wear and tear issues, we've come across two concerns on quality control.
1. After doing a load of laundry in our new RV, a neighbor at the campground knocked on the door, telling us water was pouring out from under the bedroom area. Initial inspection...the bedroom carpet was soaked! After looking at all possible plumbing lines for leaks, finally pulled up bed. Found drain line for washing machine had broken...reason...trying to make a rigid PVC tube going to gray water tank, flex with the slide going in and out. (Also found empty coke can and wire insulation trimmings, basically trash).
2. We purchased our RV in June 2011, so the 2+5 year warranty expired in 2013. We took it in every year for its annual servicing. In June 2014 water started pouring in from one of the lights by the rear AC (it was raining hard). We turned the AC off, took the light out and dried off what we could. The leak stopped. When the dealer took the AC out, they found a gasket had been installed incorrectly leaving a gap that wasn't sealed, basically causing a Venturi drawing in outside elements (rain). Long story short, every time it rained and the A/C was running it was drawing in water. Over a couple of years the decking had soaked up more than it could hold, roof decking is now soft in back area. Even though I followed the warranty by bringing the RV in, they wouldn't honor the "+5" part of warranty for structures. Saying the roof is not part of the structure.
So my answer is NO. I will not purchase another RW or Crossroads.

[Diesel chaser]

Tampabikeracer, no frame issues just things attached to it. Not at all impressed with the FIT suspesion equalizers - have not seen any yet that were greased at the factory and most have been missing zerks. If you read through the posts on this and the other RW forum you will see the trail of issues that plaque RW . Alot of these are due to assembly with the wrong screws even though the suppliers give directions for proper installation ie; awnings, spare tire mounts breaking screws due to wrong fastener for the job. Sheet metal screws holding side skirts on that many of us have had to replace with machine screws ,washers &nuts and extra bracing. Pantry drawers that need extra fasteners to keep them from beating up the pantry door. Have not seen a RW yet that the vent for the hood&microwave is installed so it opens during operation properly without modification. There are many other issues many of which are not that hard to fix, but you should not have to start fixing things that are not built or assembled properly when they are built as soon as you get your rig home. This is our 6th 5th wheel rig and I do most of my own work and have never seen issues like the RW's have. Many on here have been very helpfull with sharing fixes to some of these problems to which we can all say Thank You. But the end result in my opinion is RW's are over priced for the headaches you get with them and now they are coming out with 2 more lines- good luck seeing the quality improve.

[camachinist]

If anyone is interested in what's under the front cap of a '12 34SK, there's one stripped down right now at Toscano's in Los Banos (CA). Looks like they're going to fly in a factory engineer to look at the pin box, front frame and wall system since it failed their dimensional tests. See enclosed picture.

Not my unit but I've known the owner over 20 years and have done some work (hydraulics and structure, which are my business) on it to get him back on the road a few times and know the unit well.

Major problems, aside from the dealer finding an issue with the pin box/frame, were the axles losing camber (Lippert replaced complete axles and tires) and the ingress door side slide losing its attachment to the slide hydraulic cylinder.

Edited to add that I forgot they also replaced the roof, which the dealer said was a nearly 10K warranty job. Something involving structure underneath potentially perforating it so they had to remove, repair the structure and replace.

The converter's been a problem for awhile (flickers) and there's been some sidewall cracking (probably due to the frame flexing). The paint failed on the front and rear caps and was repainted by the dealer. Before they pulled the unit in to pull the cap (it had been sitting out in the yard awaiting factory approval), I noted one of the leveling cylinders apparently was leaking so they'll have to deal with that next.

Unit is at about 29 months and 22K miles. It was into the dealer for about 45 days (last year) for the axle issue and we're pushing about 60 days now for the pinbox/frame issue. So far, no catastrophic in-service failures but the owner, and myself, both work in heavy industrial and know machines well and what to watch out for.

I just pulled up some comps on this unit, though the market is a bit thin, and noted pricing in the 50-60K range (IIRC he paid 72K new). No, I wouldn't pay 50-60K for such a unit. Too much like work. I've got a 22yo camper that works just fine for me.

He's a patient man but we all have our limits. On a positive note, the dealer where the trailer currently is, which also sold it to him, has been stellar. Hopefully they'll be able to resolve the current issue and get the unit back on the road.

[JerryL]

I don't know if it's a 2015 QC getting better issue, or they watched mine considerably closer, due to my unusual circumstances, but I check all the issues I've read about on this forum, and mine has almost none of them. My only problem, very minor, was the washer drain hose not fit properly. Thanks to this forum, I checked that issue on my first wash, and fixed it. It wasn't bad though, just a small wet spot on the wood underneath the hose. FTR, if RW reads this forum, I severely miss the double sink. It's a pain to wash/rinse dishes with basically one large sink. My next look is to the awning bolts, and switch them out, if needed.

[Dave&Ginny]

Originally Posted by camachinist

If anyone is interested in what's under the front cap of a '12 34SK, there's one stripped down right now at Toscano's in Los Banos (CA). Looks like they're going to fly in a factory engineer to look at the pin box, front frame and wall system since it failed their dimensional tests. See enclosed picture.

Not my unit but I've known the owner over 20 years and have done some work (hydraulics and structure, which are my business) on it to get him back on the road a few times and know the unit well.

Major problems, aside from the dealer finding an issue with the pin box/frame, were the axles losing camber (Lippert replaced complete axles and tires) and the ingress door side slide losing its attachment to the slide hydraulic cylinder.

Edited to add that I forgot they also replaced the roof, which the dealer said was a nearly 10K warranty job. Something involving structure underneath potentially perforating it so they had to remove, repair the structure and replace.

The converter's been a problem for awhile (flickers) and there's been some sidewall cracking (probably due to the frame flexing). The paint failed on the front and rear caps and was repainted by the dealer. Before they pulled the unit in to pull the cap (it had been sitting out in the yard awaiting factory approval), I noted one of the leveling cylinders apparently was leaking so they'll have to deal with that next.

Unit is at about 29 months and 22K miles. It was into the dealer for about 45 days (last year) for the axle issue and we're pushing about 60 days now for the pinbox/frame issue. So far, no catastrophic in-service failures but the owner, and myself, both work in heavy industrial and know machines well and what to watch out for.

I just pulled up some comps on this unit, though the market is a bit thin, and noted pricing in the 50-60K range (IIRC he paid 72K new). No, I wouldn't pay 50-60K for such a unit. Too much like work. I've got a 22yo camper that works just fine for me.

He's a patient man but we all have our limits. On a positive note, the dealer where the trailer currently is, which also sold it to him, has been stellar. Hopefully they'll be able to resolve the current issue and get the unit back on the road.

Sorry to hear that he's having these issues but so far I haven't heard of other having problems with the "Pin" area.

If this was due to an engineering problem, you'd think with the trailers being built for 4 years there would be others.

[johnboytoo]

is a stress crack a problem in the pin area ?
(it's much bigger than this now )

[0nTheRoad]

Originally Posted by johnboytoo

is a stress crack a problem in the pin area ?
(it's much bigger than this now )

Redwood will fix this, if you haven't had it looked at by a dealer you should get it in NOW!!! If the dealer doesn't take care of it, call Crossroads Service Center for resolution.

[jhardin]

Picked up our 2015 38GK end of March this year so the unit is only 7 months old. We have had over 50 items repaired or repaired others myself. I realize there are small problems that come up with campers because we have owned 5-6 others. But the majority of the items was due to no quality inspections at the factory. Most should have been repaired before it went out of the factory. We will not buy another RW unless they do some serious changes in the near future. I am waiting 70+ days for warranty work on 17 items right now and there are three Crossroads dealers within 60 miles of me. They will have to earn my respect in the next 2-3 years before we research our next new unit.

[TNTBaker]

We definitely have our issues, on a steady basis. Thankfully, they have been mostly minor, and we can fix ourselves, but it DOES wear on you. We find ourselves saying, "ANOTHER thing that's not right". Trim falling off, plastic shavings in the water lines clogging the faucets, dishwasher drain hose installed wrong, emergency exit window on rear cap won't open because it's behind the ladder, kitchen sink not sealed and leaks... the list gets longer every day. I agree with most everyone else, they are mostly QC issues. Things that make you say, "They DEFINITELY knew this was wrong when they sent this unit out, and sent it out anyway". That is frustrating for sure.

Recently, we had our first service on some warranty items. I will post in a different topic on that, it went very well.

Frankly, I don't CARE what is typical in the "industry". RW, or ANY manufacturer of a higher-end coach MUST take care of these issues. To have a person on the line KNOWINGLY leave something wrong, or worse, intentionally NOT install something correctly is UNACCEPTABLE. If I were running things, we would have weekly meetings with the line-people, and I would say, "Ok, Joe, we have had 17 coaches have their awnings fall off in the last 3 months, and it has cost us thousands to repair them. YOU'RE FIRED." There doesn't appear to be any consequences to doing a poor job on the line. These are largely minor problems.

All that being said; YES I would buy a RW again, because it isn't any worse in the QC department than the others, from what I have been able to learn.

[DLRAKOWITZ]

Nope but my wife would love to sell you ours

[lwg]

Ahhh the trim falling off. This is one item that does make me crazy. I need to grab a small punch and go around the Redwood and nail most of the trim back into it's place, and hope it stays... Maybe a bead of glue behind it would help?

[TNTBaker]

Whatever it is, they should have done it at the factory ;-) But, as we all know, they are just too busy pumping them out to care about that.

[Radio_Flyer]

I gotta ask the question. For the most part, other than trim work and some very minor issues, ours has been trouble free and nothing I couldn't fix. Would definitely buy a RW again. But my question, my rig and older are all Thor. Seems that the Thor rigs are holding up and had better QC than CrossRoads. I don't see as many complaints with the Thor made rigs? Is it just a bad assumption on my part?

[0nTheRoad]

Radio_Flyer,

Both Redwood and Crossroads are Thor products as are many other towables including Heartland. Thor is the parent company, the funding source, but each brand is as standalone division and are responsible for their profitability.
It gets a little weird for Redwood/Crossroads though, Redwood is it's own entity but Crossroads does the warranty & service work, think of it as a subcontractor. Perhaps if Redwood gets bigger they will take back their warranty/service work but who knows if that will happen and when...for now it is what it is.

[camachinist]

Originally Posted by 0nTheRoad

Radio_Flyer,

<snip>It gets a little weird for Redwood/Crossroads though, Redwood is it's own entity but Crossroads does the warranty & service work, think of it as a subcontractor. Perhaps if Redwood gets bigger they will take back their warranty/service work but who knows if that will happen and when...for now it is what it is.

Yeah, we found this confusing as well. The unit I mentioned prior is a 'Redwood by Thor' unit, manufactured early 2012, actually fifth off the line of the then new 34' size, and someone from Crossroads, actually same name as a famous Hollywood director, was handling the current issues until he left the company a couple weeks ago.

Now the political process is begun again as the new guy plows through all the correspondence. Oddly, they keep telling us 'Falcon' made the frame, even though 'Lippert' stated the frame was out of warranty and it's Lippert's name on the pin box tags and axles. Right now, no one will state in writing that the unit is unsafe to tow or safe to tow so it's in limbo, in pieces, and sitting. Considering the sunk cost, that doesn't bode well as a testimonial.

[atom ant]

There is no such thing as Falcon. It's a hype concept. All of your frame, axle, pin box, brakes, stairs, hitch, jacks, windows, doors.. are made by Lippert or Lippert owned companies (i.e. Trailair)

[camachinist]

Yes, that was my original assertion when hearing of this. However, the Crossroads guy was adamant that they were sending in an engineer from their 'Falcon frame plant in Oregon' to inspect the frame, as it was manufactured by Falcon. I did find what could be considered a frame plant (not full frames but perhaps assemblies from the images of the facility) listed under corporate information for Lippert and it appears to exist in Central Oregon.

Then the guy mysteriously leaves the company. Stuff happens I guess. In any event, there's been no one from any frame manufacturer on-site yet to inspect the frame, now two weeks on from the original promise.

In their defense, there is a nice 'FIT' badge on the pin box, which apparently stands for Falcon Integrated Technology, a marketing program which Redwood/Lippert apparently used at the time.

Here's an article:

http://www.rvbusiness.com/2010/11/li...i-one-chassis/

" ”We are branding it as LCI ONE,” said Jason Lippert, chairman and CEO of Goshen, Ind.-based Lippert. ”It’s one source for all your chassis and suspension needs. With us, if there’s a problem, it’s one point of contact and not all the finger pointing. That’s the largest benefit.” As a manufacturer managing all those components, he points out, OEMs only have to make one phone call instead of having to contact 10 or 12 suppliers. The idea for an all-inclusive chassis, he said, came from Thor Industries Inc.’s new Redwood RV subsidiary, which is marketing Lippert’s new concept platform as Falcon Integrated Technology (FIT) on its new luxury fifth-wheel"